- Ruriko
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I just wanted to say a quick thing
Do not take me wrong but I think we might be a bit tone down for calling K as a lair…. I know many groups said that these fences seemed very suspicious (because I am a member of Kachiku Otasuke Tai so I know they had photos etc), but there is no concrete evidence to call him a lair. Believe or not what we said in public especially on the website we have to take a full responsibility for it. So I would not call him a lair if we do not have a concrete evidence (for example, I am not convinced that the amount of blood in the photo kills a cow since I work with horses and they get cut by themselves by scratching fences or branches and I have seen that they get breeding that much and I get cut one time pretty badly and I got that much blood out before as well. I do not think it would kill a cow)Dr Imamoto said it is very much fact that local farmers were completely confused and tired of all of this. So I think we have to be very very very careful (I think HOSHI san was very upset at Kachiku Otasuke Tai because they release info without verifying them. This causes much much much more harm).
So I would not call him a liar yet…..
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December 6, 2011R
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Just IMO and I just wanted to say as a friend
So please do not get offended
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December 7, 2011
R
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K at M… seems working with Animal forest…. So I think he is ok Just FYI.
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December 11, 2011
Ruriko
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Hey dear,
I know you are very upset at the government but I think you might want to post articles after verifying them because Dr Kakizaki and Dr Imamoto are trying to save livestock under the name of “research” but because of many rumors the research projects were almost canceled (dr Kakizaki and Imamoto told me) because the farmers thought they are killing them under the name of research. They are trying to save livestock for farmers (especially Takamura resp is involved) so I would be very very careful to post these kind of article….
Thanks!!!
R
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December 11, 2011Y
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R,
I understand, and for you, your study may not be involved with killing anything. But, you have no idea what the other studies involve. If you have seen them, I would love to read the abstracts and see for myself that there is no harm being done to the animal. If you know where the abstracts are, let me know, I will be happy to go and read them. MAFF itself said on the Q&A page said that animals are killed to examine internal radiation.Once I can see the abstracts and confirm that none of the cattle used for research are not killed, I will be happy to retract what I have said, and will stop what I am writing.
But, also, I am also upset that they are taking livestock and not paying the farmers for the livestock. The cattle have a worth, to the people that do the research. Researchers generally have to pay for their test animals, like the knockout mice, the beagles, rabbits, etc. Having the farmer give them animals and not pay for them is wrong. Those farmers should be compensated for the livestock used for research. The get nothing from this.
Why isn’t MAFF giving some of the money that they are using to finance the research to the farmers for the livestock? It is all going to the researchers. Are the researchers paying the farmers? I am going to guess, No. That is not right.
I understand what your research is about. This has nothing to do with your research. It is to do with what is going on with other researchers.
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December 11, 2011
R
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Where is MAFF? Also I do not think this is what you think. Like I said I talked to Drs Kakizaki and Imamoto in person…..
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I am talking about the article you posted. This is about research conducted by Dr Kakizaki team. He had already very much hard time to explain to farmers because they thought Dr Kakizaki et al were going to kill them for research which is not true. They told me Dr Kakizaki had to go there and met everyone to explain details.
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December 11, 2011
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Where is the study? Where can I read the abstract and methodology of the study?
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December 11, 2011
R
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I do not have one with me. I can ask Dr Kakizaki to give it to you.
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But I think the research method is the same as mine. Our objective is to get data sets from cows from observational study (of course we will get blood etc in order to assess contamination but we are not planning to kill them). I think Kitazato university has 30 cows now so I do not think they are planning to kill them because they have such a small sample size. Also please note that we can get contamination from the blood sample…..
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December 11, 2011
R
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This is a very much sensitive issue so please please please careful. Dr Imamoto planned to conduct “research” in order to save them but this plan was canceled because of animal groups who do not agree with research animals.
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December 11, 2011
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R,
I know what your research proposes. The original article mentioned 17 studies. There are 17 studies being done, that I know of. If you have what the 17 studies are, and none of them say anything about sacrificing animals, I will stop. But, I am not talking about your study. I understand yours.
There are 17 studies. If Dr Kakizaki produces an abstract that says there is no harm to the cattle, I will show his study as an example of GOOD research as yours.
ok?
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December 11, 2011
R
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Thank you
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December 11, 2011
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This is about his study, not the other people that I have no idea about. I will continue to say that other researchers are going to kill the livestock. On a realistic level, out of the 17 studies, there will be someone that will kill to measure something. I am not that naive.
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December 12, 2011
R
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But please be careful because these things might hurt someone including animals in the exclusion zone.
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December 12, 2011
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R,
I am just not seeing how what I say will hurt the animals. The Government of Japan will do what it wants, like the joke of the rescue that is happening now. Like all the other joke rescues that happened in the past. MAFF has not rescinded its order to cull livestock. Livestock will continue to be culled. How long have the Tamaki reps been “talking” about things? They have no power to change what the Prime Minister ordered. They can save a select few for research purposes, but even that is not 100% since not all radiation studies guarantee that livestock used will not be killed. I am a small FB page. I do not have the numbers that HC or even Boycoot or JEARS have. How can what I say have any impact? I do not. I write because someone should be saying something about all the animals that are dying, or will die.As I said before, I understand what your study is about. I have no idea what any other study is about. And, no, I do not trust any other researcher. I find it curious that the abstracts are unpublished. What are they trying to hide? Yamane had an abstract that was published for radiation study and guess what? It was removed, but I have it. And, guess what, it kills.
Not all people want to save animals. You should not be worried since you know you have nothing to do with all the other studies. If those studies end up killing animals, how is that hurting them?
If the researchers that are trying to save animals show the people that are concerned that they are not going to kill them, then, those people will not be worried. If this happens to other researchers, it is up to them to prove to the people that they are not going to kill the animals like the other researcher did. For those researchers that have lied , well, then, they will have to tell the people the truth. And, the people will find out that the researcher has lied and intended to kill their animals. There is no harm done to anyone by having the truth revealed.
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December 12, 2011
R
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This is truth. For example, Dr Kakizaki and Dr Imamot are trying to save animals. Bad rumors about them almost cost livestock’s life (because their research project was almost canceled). This is because these things confuse local farmers. I talked to Drs as well as some other rescuers in Japan. This is so sensitive issues for local farmers so we have to be VERY careful. They are so tired and they do not have money. So they do not have so much strength to protect their livestock. They are on the limit.
Please understand farmers’ point of view. Now there is so much information out there so they do not believe a thing. They are on an edge…. This is why we have to release something after 99% sure these are facts.
I know researchers at Kitasato University is trying to save them with Dr Imamoto and also try to save local farmers more. We have to care about tsunami and nuclear victims.
Please remember. The only way now we can save livestock is to make them as research animals.
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December 12, 2011
R
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This is also heard from local farmers via Otasuke Tai (I am currently member so I get all information from them). The word “I feel so bad for livestock so please do not kill them” does not work. Actually these words insult local farmers because these words do not help them but insult them. They want to help their livestock but they cannot.
So this is why I do not say anything about livestock on FB. Instead I am doing something to save them.
They need money to keep them alive. But farmers do not have any. So I think instead of spreading rumors or saying poor livestock I think we might want to keep thinking how we can save them. The best way to save them is getting money to keep them alive (maybe promote M-farm donation or chip in?)
But please do not take me wrong. I know you want to save livestock but I know the situation there and very sensitive situation. So please understand…..
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